FrenchgirlinTO2 Posted November 7, 2020 Share Posted November 7, 2020 Hi, what kind of sparrow is that? I'm bad with Sparrows. ? thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melierax Posted November 7, 2020 Share Posted November 7, 2020 White-crowned Sparrow. Immature I believe. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pictaker Posted November 8, 2020 Share Posted November 8, 2020 Agreed.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akandula Posted November 8, 2020 Share Posted November 8, 2020 Looks like it's just starting to get that adult plumage in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Leukering Posted November 8, 2020 Share Posted November 8, 2020 17 hours ago, Melierax said: Immature I believe. Why don't you know? It's not streaky, so is not a juvenile and does not have a black-and-white head pattern, so is not an adult. Immature is all that remains. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melierax Posted November 8, 2020 Share Posted November 8, 2020 (edited) 2 hours ago, Tony Leukering said: Why don't you know? It's not streaky, so is not a juvenile and does not have a black-and-white head pattern, so is not an adult. Immature is all that remains. I get juvenile and immature mixed up as concepts. Edited November 8, 2020 by Melierax 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexHenry Posted November 8, 2020 Share Posted November 8, 2020 36 minutes ago, Melierax said: I get juvenile and immature mixed up as concepts. Juvenile White-crowned Sparrows are streaky and are mostly seen on the breeding grounds Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melierax Posted November 8, 2020 Share Posted November 8, 2020 1 minute ago, AlexHenry said: Juvenile White-crowned Sparrows are streaky and are mostly seen on the breeding grounds Yeah I know, I just can never remember the technically definitions of immature and juvenile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IKLland Posted November 8, 2020 Share Posted November 8, 2020 19 hours ago, akandula said: Looks like it's just starting to get that adult plumage in. Yes you can see a hint of black Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seanbirds Posted November 8, 2020 Share Posted November 8, 2020 2 hours ago, Melierax said: Yeah I know, I just can never remember the technically definitions of immature and juvenile. Immature is any bird that is not a full adult (juveniles included), and a juvenile is a bird in its first calendar year, @Melierax. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Bird Nuts Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 3 hours ago, Seanbirds said: Immature is any bird that is not a full adult (juveniles included), and a juvenile is a bird in its first calendar year, @Melierax. That is eBird's definition (to make it easier for eBirders, I think). I believe an ornithologist would disagree with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benjamin Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 4 hours ago, Seanbirds said: Immature is any bird that is not a full adult (juveniles included), and a juvenile is a bird in its first calendar year, @Melierax. Yeah, that's not correct. Juvenile generally refers to a bird in its first non-downy plumage, while immature just refers to any bird that has not acquired adult plumage. Meaning that immature is an umbrella term which includes all juvenile birds, while juvenile is a more precise term that refers to a particular plumage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Bird Nuts Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 15 hours ago, Seanbirds said: Immature is any bird that is not a full adult (juveniles included), and a juvenile is a bird in its first calendar year, @Melierax. I'm sorry, I read your post incorrectly. I didn't realize you said "a juvenile is a bird in its first calendar year" -- that is correct only for certain species (like hawks). Benjamin is right that a juvenile is a bird in its first set of feathers. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe Tony Leukering says that immature does not include juvenile, but is a term only used for birds that are between juvenile and adult plumage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benjamin Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 Part of the confusion is that even within the academic community, I don't know that there are agreed definitions for all of these terms. That said, I've never heard of juvenile not being included under the umbrella of immature. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seanbirds Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 On 11/8/2020 at 9:22 PM, Benjamin said: Yeah, that's not correct. Juvenile generally refers to a bird in its first non-downy plumage, while immature just refers to any bird that has not acquired adult plumage. Meaning that immature is an umbrella term which includes all juvenile birds, while juvenile is a more precise term that refers to a particular plumage. I think that's what I said. Is it not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benjamin Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 4 hours ago, Seanbirds said: I think that's what I said. Is it not? You said a juvenile bird is one that is in its first calendar year, this is not correct. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seanbirds Posted November 11, 2020 Share Posted November 11, 2020 20 hours ago, Benjamin said: You said a juvenile bird is one that is in its first calendar year, this is not correct. Oh. Right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelLong Posted November 12, 2020 Share Posted November 12, 2020 confusing 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Posted November 12, 2020 Share Posted November 12, 2020 13 hours ago, MichaelLong said: confusing AGREED Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melierax Posted November 12, 2020 Share Posted November 12, 2020 So you see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seanbirds Posted November 12, 2020 Share Posted November 12, 2020 Thank you, @Benjamin, for setting me straight. ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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