Crow or Raven?

[SirVive]

https://macaulaylibrary.org/asset/456939001

 

Popped up on the photo quiz and from this angle I would have called this a crow. If I'm wrong why?

[PaulK]

I can't tell from your post if you looked at the other photos in the checklist and you're restricting us to this one in particular, or just saw the one photo?

[IKLland]

Raven

[SirVive]

4 hours ago, PaulK said:

I can't tell from your post if you looked at the other photos in the checklist and you're restricting us to this one in particular, or just saw the one photo?

I only saw the one photo until you mentioned it. I agree that the other photos are definitely raven. I usually don't have any trouble telling them apart in the field but you almost always get a better angle than that at some point. Mostly wondering if there was any good way to tell simply from this photo. 

[PaulK]

It's a good question. To me the feathers on the neck are ruffly not fully smooth and it has an awful lot of tail. I'd have called it a crow from that picture though so that's just looking at it now.

[tris johnson]

Bill looks too short to be a Raven, right? At least in the main photo. 

Edited June 27, 2022 by tris johnson

[RobinHood]

@SirVive. FWIW. I thought this was an interesting question as the ID from the single photo could be challenging, but absolutely no doubt from the other photos in the same report. Crows and Ravens are common locally but I find Ravens can vary from "nothing else it could be" to "crow wannabees". I wonder if it is partially age related - structure, shaggy throat and especially bill mass seems to vary a lot.

In flight the wedge shaped tail is distinctive but in this photo I'm not sure if it is helpful, or is it?

I came across two birds this morning which I took to be an adult and juvenile Raven (one of the earliest to nest locally), very distant and shooting through foliage so poor photos. In the one photo (OOF) the head shape (angular with a peak and then a down slope) I think is indicative as crows tend to have a more rounded head shape.

Happy to be corrected but had hoped some of our experts could offer some insights.

I suspect this does not help much for this particular photo ID which for me would probably be crow/raven.

[SirVive]

7 hours ago, RobinHood said:

@SirVive. FWIW. I thought this was an interesting question as the ID from the single photo could be challenging, but absolutely no doubt from the other photos in the same report. Crows and Ravens are common locally but I find Ravens can vary from "nothing else it could be" to "crow wannabees". I wonder if it is partially age related - structure, shaggy throat and especially bill mass seems to vary a lot.

In flight the wedge shaped tail is distinctive but in this photo I'm not sure if it is helpful, or is it?

I came across two birds this morning which I took to be an adult and juvenile Raven (one of the earliest to nest locally), very distant and shooting through foliage so poor photos. In the one photo (OOF) the head shape (angular with a peak and then a down slope) I think is indicative as crows tend to have a more rounded head shape.

Happy to be corrected but had hoped some of our experts could offer some insights.

I suspect this does not help much for this particular photo ID which for me would probably be crow/raven.

I'd probably have stuck with the spuh for the first two photos but called both birds in the last one ravens. Especially the tail on the left looks awfully long for a crow but maybe that's just pose.

[SirVive]

These are one of those questions where I tend to believe the O. P. rather than an ID of a crummy photo if they have any clue about how to tell the difference in the field because so many of the easy field clues are GISS, behavior, and of course voice. More than likely any 5 second video clip of this bird would seal the ID one way or the other but only being given that one photo was hard. Glad I'm not completely crazy to have called it a crow.